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Post by Lucid on Jun 14, 2007 17:15:01 GMT -5
Hey guys
Any of you guys know about PROM tuning? I just got the Moate's Burn1 chip burner with a few chips for burning EPROMS.
I have a cable for Data Logging now, and my laptop has most of the programs ready for tuning, like TunerPro.
I still need to buy the TPI adapter so i can bypass the memcal and get going but i need help with BINS and tables and stuff like that.
The first thing i want to do is activate Highway Mode on the chip so i can save some gas.
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Post by irocvirrilli on Jun 14, 2007 21:17:45 GMT -5
i'm not too good with computers but i know my way around with scanners and stuff and i think i know some computer whizzes who could help, maybe thomas can assist us in this department cuz i need a chip to enter my big engine into closed loop wioth that five speed
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Post by Lucid on Jun 17, 2007 20:21:12 GMT -5
Well if you could go to thirdgen.org and look under the DIY Prom board and learn as much as you can about the subject it would help.
An emulator would really help to finalize the settings quickly on a big engine, but i cant afford to buy it yet.
What size engine do you have in your car? We might be able to take an existing BIN and burn a chip that will work on the engine you have, we just have to be very careful on the timing and fuel delivery.
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Post by Lucid on Jun 18, 2007 15:28:48 GMT -5
Vader from thirdgen.org was nice enough to give me a crash course and access to the BIN file he uses on his 86 setup and i think i have a pretty good understanding on how to modify and burn the chips now.
As soon as i buy the adapter for my ECM i will burn a chip and let you all know how it goes.
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Post by irocvirrilli on Jun 19, 2007 21:49:46 GMT -5
i have a 1989 305 with TPI. The only modifications that i have done or am in the process of are porting the intake plenum and runners, swapping out the cam and lifters and installing a jegs/ez ignition/performance kit stage 1 if oyu look on jegs its under TPI. I'm working on all that and possibly a bigger throttle body. I wanted to talk to you about all the computer stuff before i possibly bought a hypertech chip.By the way the car is a 5 speed if you need that info
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Post by Lucid on Jun 20, 2007 15:03:20 GMT -5
1989 was the last year of the MAF sensor computers and the last year of that tuning available, and probably the best platform to do modifications. According to Vader, this year uses the $6E "mask" or calibration coding, which is the most widely used and has the most features to modify. 1986-1989 all CAN use the 1989 ARAP (automatic) or APYS or AUJS (manual tranny) BINS with some modifications. The hypertech chip is something we can probably do one up on, since what they do is change some constants: such as what temperature the car goes into closed loop mode and redo some of the tables such as : spark advance vs rpm tables. Hypertech never runs a datalogging on your car and tunes your car from data obtained from your computer. The main problem with pre-made chips is that they usually just turn the timing (spark advance) all the way up which either will make your engine run really well or cause it to detonate and ruin your engine. Each engine likes a different amount of timing, and the 305 engine is extremely timing sensitive. If you wanted to change the the timing and remove some of the advance you can do it manually and burn a chip, with hypertech you cant, unless you have them do a custom tune. Grumpy on thirdgen.org on one of his posts said what the differences were between a stock chip and a hypertech chip, you might want to do a search and find it. They call them "off the shelf type" chips though. If you can be patient, then i would say lets give the chip burning a try. It will take awhile for us to get the tuning right though without an emulator. If you are interested, you will most likely want to buy the adapter for the TPI Memcal on www.moates.net under chips and adapters. Either the G1 or the G3. I will keep this posted whenever i can get internet access.
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Post by irocvirrilli on Jun 22, 2007 9:50:31 GMT -5
ill go check out that website and i have lots of patience since my money comes in only small quantities since i'm only 17 but yea sounds like a good plan
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Post by Lucid on Jun 24, 2007 0:58:11 GMT -5
I just got the adapter in today with a ZIF that you plug the MEMCAL into and plug into the ECM like a nintendo cartridge. I burned the chip with the $6E Mask today with the ARAP BIN type programming thats been tweaked by Vader. The mask is the calibration and version type, and the BIN is the actual program the ECM uses.
I am going to pull the ECM tomorrow and plug it in, and let you all know how it comes out. Vino, this program will probably run fine on your engine with some tweaking for you settings, right now its setup for a 180 thermostat.
There is a thing called a Flag that you can check to enable Manual Transmission for the ECM and even disable VATS if you want to for that year, so updating the ECM for your 5 Speed is really simple.
Sorry i couldnt make it to jam out tonight, i was pretty tired and i sprained my ankle on thursday night.
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Post by irocvirrilli on Jun 24, 2007 1:13:18 GMT -5
its all good man. just let me know how it works on your tpi. i'm gonna buy a 350 from thomas so we'll have to make on a chip for that motor with the manual as well as try the 305
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Post by irocvirrilli on Jun 24, 2007 21:54:16 GMT -5
hey brian, i have a perfectly good computer with the chip and all in it just lying around. Next time we meet up i'll give it to you as a burn test dummy lol or prototype
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Post by Lucid on Jun 25, 2007 15:51:04 GMT -5
I installed the chip in the car, and had to take apart the ecm for it to fit. When i put it back together, its only squeezing the MEMCAL slightly, so i can live with it. Its installed with the ZIF so it should be easy to swap chips now. The car feels totally different now, it idles and coasts very smoothly. I heard that custom tuning makes it smoother, but it even smoother with the A/C on. I had a really really choppy idle before in gear, and it feels way different now, i thought i was driving the mustang for a minute. The spark advance really kicks in at higher RPM's now instead of dying off and leaving the 305 hanging. I think the total advance is somewhere around 47 degrees, Vader was right about how much timing these engines can take. You can feel the highway mode kick in and it does seem to be saving gas, i will keep an eye on my fuel mileage and let you all know. I set it to kick in at 55 MPH and you can feel the difference above and below that speed. Irocvirilli Whats the part# on the ECM and the code on the chip? If you notice on the table below, the difference between your ECM and my ECM is just the calibration and version of the MAF program used. The cool thing about the MAF programs is that you can use any version of the program between the 86 through 89 years interchangeably. The version i am now running is the 89 year $6E calibration. The same one will probably work on yours without much modification, since the MAF sensor will be able to compensate for your different modifications because its a very, very good way of measuring the actual air properties. It can measure air flow, density, compensate for temperature, humidity and other variables. You will need a G1 or G3 adapter from Moates.net and it will allow you to bypass the EPROM in the MEMCAL and insert your very own. I also bought a S3 ZIF (zero insertion force) socket from him so that i dont have to physically press the chip in the socket. If you have ever changed a CPU out of a CPU socket you will know what a ZIF socket is, and how easy it makes things. ECM, EPROM, and Calibration reference Year (TPI) 1985 1986 1987 1988 1989 1990+ ECM Type C3 P4 P4 P4 P4 P4 ECM ID 1226870 1227165 '165 '165 '165 1227730 EPROM 2732 27C128 27C128 27C128 '128 27C256 BIN Size 4Kb 16Kb 16Kb 16Kb 16Kb 32Kb Mask $1F $32 $32B $32B $6E $ E Man. MAF MAF MAF MAF MAF MAP Baud Rate 160 8192 8192 8192 8192 8192 MemCal No Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes Bare EPROM Yes No No No No No
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Post by z28camaroracer on Jun 29, 2007 18:42:46 GMT -5
Hey man can you do anything for a 2.8 maf tuning, The correct base advance helps alot .
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Post by Lucid on Jun 30, 2007 4:02:15 GMT -5
I am pretty sure that we can, its going to be a little different tuning wise since yours is an 89 Speed Density setup? But it has been done before on those masks. If i am correct that ECM is either a 1227727 or a 1227730 which is an $ mask. I think its the '730 ECM which a very common SD setup based on the MAP sensor readings. There is a setting that you can pick which engine you have, an 8 a 6 or a 4 cylinder, the ECM runs the same program either way. I will look into it more when i have a little more time. In regards to the base timing, yes there is a setting where you can pick any base timing. I initially had it setup at 13 BTDC since we ran it that way at the track and burned the chip with that as a base. The other day i burned a revised chip with it at 6 BTDC and adjusted my base timing with the timing light to match it. (Personally i like it at 13 degrees, it picks up much better). I checked my fuel mileage and noticed it was exactly 13 miles per gallon. I have been gunning it and running the A/C during the day, but i thought it would have been a little better. I am going to have to tweak it, the highway mode AFR was 15.4 which is only marginally better than 14.7:1. The chip i burned the other night i bumped it up to 16.0:1.
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Post by z28camaroracer on Jun 30, 2007 11:00:43 GMT -5
No man my 89 is not SD it is Mass air (maf)
I will look at the ecm number.
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Post by irocvirrilli on Jun 30, 2007 11:40:57 GMT -5
hey there's no numbers on my ecm that ihave left over brian, it's jsut got some hand written number but i'll give it to you either way for those guys who have TBI cars
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